[Sigia-l] Web browser based diagramming

[Peter Van Dijck]

My comment at the summit was about pain. Fix the pain. These "do-it-all" 
tools, I've seen too many of them. And they all have have failed, at 
some point. Perhaps someone will nail it, but until then, there are 
quite a few painpoints IA's actually struggle with, that are not being 
addressed. Content inventories suck, parly coz of the tools. Speccing 
out ajax stuff: no good tools. *That* is where I'd like to see some 
efforts. The things we actually struggle with.

Peter

Listera wrote:
> Stewart Dean:
> 
> 
>>The Expression tool set is not an IA toolset - it's a web design toolset.
> 
> 
> Microsoft is not interested in web (site) design. They never have been. They
> sat on IE for half a decade, for which Gates apologized this week. They are
> interested in *application* design, as their roots and commercial interests
> are in the desktop application space.
>  
> 
>>There are back end developement tools,
> 
> 
> The Expression suite is NOT explicitly targeting backend developers.
> 
> 
>>front end developement tools
> 
> 
> They are explicitly targeting designers.
> 
> 
>>but no experience structure tools.
> 
> 
> What's that?
> 
> The value proposition of Expression is that *unifies* the design and
> development process on a common XAML platform, which travels between
> designers and developers without change, reinterpretation or transformation.
> With Expression you create actual OS widgets that are fully functional
> without writing code. They are not placeholders or simulations. As a
> designer you get to give them behaviors and interaction.
> 
> 
>>An experience structure could be created to work with diffrent back end
>>systems and with different user interfaces so,  in my view, my vision of an IA
>>tool is independent to both at it's core.
> 
> 
> Which is in some contrast to Expression in the sense that Expression doesn't
> single out one phase of app creation and isolate it from others as a
> disjointed deliverable. It embraces the unity and integrated nature of
> design from concept through functional prototype, which, in Expression,
> happens to be functional executable code as well.
> 
> 
>>I covered the Microsoft tools elsewhere, they're all miles away from the IA
>>problem in my view and miss what I see as the core of user expience, the
>>strucutre and flow.
> 
> 
> "core of user expience, the strucutre and flow" is not something that needs
> to be abstracted out of the design process, in the Expression paradigm. You
> don't need to abstract it as a disjointed deliverable, precisely because you
> imbue that within the iterated, ongoing prototype. The application speaks
> for itself.
> 
> I point these out not to underline whether you misunderstood Expression or
> not, but to fundamentally question the notion of a "true IA tool," whatever
> that may be.
> 
> ----
> Ziya
> 
> "If you can't feed a team with two pizzas, the size of the team is too
> large."
> 
> 
> ------------
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