[Sigia-l] "Who Really Turns Off JavaScript?"

[Paul Ringger]

Hello,

With today's development tools, most of this type of issue is not part
of the problem you are solving.  It's assumed that you have no idea what
someone may use to access the site as the lowest common denominator then
you add optional functionality that enhances the experience as the
browser capabilities increase.

There have been many terms describing this and similar approaches over
the years.  At the moment, it seems the term is "progressive
enhancement." Ajax and other "web 2.0" buzz words that affect the
browsing experience fall under this label.

A few references:

Progressive Enhancement and the Future of Web Design
http://hesketh.com/publications/progressive_enhancement_and_the_future_o
f_web_design.html 

Progressive enhancement with Ajax
http://adactio.com/journal/display.php/20050308163812.xml


So what does this have to do with the JavaScript question?

There are tools and features that exist within the various development
platforms that make this somewhat of a moot discussion.  For example, on
the Microsoft platform, .NET WebForm controls already support adaptive
rendering that creates both the server-side validation and the
client-side validation on the fly.  They work together.  If the client
doesn't have JavaScript enabled, the server-side validation is used.
The developer doesn't have to worry about the "either or" if they use
controls to render all of the options which are detected by .NET when a
new session for a new user is created.

If you don't like Microsoft's controls, there are third-party options as
well:
http://www.peterblum.com/VAM/


In the world of ColdFusion, there's a great product called "Terraform"
that does a similar type of automation.   As a developer, you say what
form element you need, what are its validation requirements and other
logic then the UI elements are generated by the software.  You then
extend Terraform by using "qForms Javascript API" which generates all of
the Javascript connected to the form elements. 

TerraForm
http://www.electricsheep.co.nz/products/terraform/index.cfm

qForms JavaScript API
http://www.pengoworks.com/index.cfm?action=get:qforms

The point is that developers have already wrapped all of the
client/server pieces together in packages that address graceful
degradation for web applications automatically. You shouldn't really
have to look at this question as either a binary option or as only
addressing the lowest common denominator.  You take a layered approach
that encapsulates each new level of UI capability as it applies to a
matching browser capability whether it's JavaScript, CSS2 or some other
feature.  

Similar sets of tools probably exist for PHP, Java and others as well.
If you (whoever you are) know the good ones, send them along!

That's my 2 cents.

Paul Ringger

-----Original Message-----
From: sigia-l-bounces at asis.org [mailto:sigia-l-bounces at asis.org] On
Behalf Of Skot Nelson
Sent: Monday, November 07, 2005 9:34 PM
To: T. Karsjens
Cc: 'SIGIA-L'
Subject: Re: [Sigia-l] "Who Really Turns Off JavaScript?"


On Nov-7-2005, at 6:41 PM, T. Karsjens wrote:

>
>> something that works 100% of the time, versus something that works 
>> 85% of the time.
>
> Do they sell these kinds of stats at discount stores?
> 15% JavaScript turnoff stat is simply bogus.

> If you want to fight with straw man arguments of your own fantasy, you

> are on your own.

For god's sake, how is He Who Shall Not Be Named allowed to get away
with this kind of insulting bullshit? Both of these comments are
outrageously offensive, and at the least Timothy (and maybe the entire
list) is owed a public apology.

--
Scott Nelson
skot at penguinstorm.com
http://www.penguinstorm.com/

skype. skot.nelson


------------
When replying, please *trim your post* as much as possible.
*Plain text, please; NO Attachments

Searchable Archive at http://www.info-arch.org/lists/sigia-l/

IA 06 Summit.  Mark your calendar.  March 23-27, Vancouver, BC


________________________________________
Sigia-l mailing list -- post to: Sigia-l at asis.org Changes to
subscription: http://mail.asis.org/mailman/listinfo/sigia-l