[Sigia-l] RE: Visual Balance vs. Left Leaning Layouts (Lerner, Pablo)

Wed Dec 3 12:10:16 EST 2003

I've been reading the issue, about the "tension" between the IA and the
designers. I'm sure that here in Argentina, we have a different way for
work, for management, for seeing the IA. At the UBA (University of Buenos
Aires) since we started with the project of our website (4 years ago), we
joined with graphic designers, web programmers, editors. We strongly believe
in a multidisciplinary work, an interaction space, as a learning oportunity.
When Microsoft supported the Risk Model Management,  that push us to work
separated, we choosed the strategic planning for management with the
critical thinking as a valuable source. In conclusion, that tension that u
mention we doesnt have.

Pablo Lerner
www.uba.ar

----- Original Message -----
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To: <sigia-l at asis.org>
Sent: Wednesday, December 03, 2003 2:01 PM
Subject: Sigia-l digest, Vol 1 #757 - 6 msgs

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> Today's Topics:
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>    1. RE: Visual Balance vs. Left Leaning Layouts (Hankinson, Jody)
>    2. Re: Visual Balance vs. Left Leaning Layouts (Brett-Luxaco)
>    3. RE: Visual Balance vs. Left Leaning Layouts (Dave Collins)
>    4. Re: Visual Balance vs. Left Leaning Layouts (Alexander Johannesen)
>    5. IA, Metrics & org structure (Michael Rabjohns)
>    6. Re: IA, Metrics & org structure (Donna M. Fritzsche)
>
> --__--__--
>
> Message: 1
> From: "Hankinson, Jody" <JHankinson at girlscouts.org>
> To: sigia-l at asis.org
> Subject: RE: [Sigia-l] Visual Balance vs. Left Leaning Layouts
> Date: Tue, 2 Dec 2003 15:47:10 -0500
>
> I'm a little late to the thread, but I'm surprised by what wasn't
posted...
>
> Have you shared your motivations for wanting the navigation a certain way?
I
> have learned through trial and error that tension arises between the
> Designers and the IAs, because there isn't enough sharing of the project
> goals, interface goals and the *usability* goals, i.e. "I'd like the
> navigation on the left because proximity better illustrates relationships
> between the categories, but it also gives us room to grow the navigation
in
> the future without subjecting everyone to a new design."
>
> If that approach isn't successful, ask for one of the design treatments to
> be a reflection of your goals. Three treatments seems to be the norm and
> I've yet to have anyone balk at trying to prove me wrong by poorly
designing
> the approach they don't like. The process can be illuminating for the
> designer, but it also gives me something I can use for a friends & family
> test. Amazing what a quick test around the office can prove even if the
> color pallet looks like vomit.
>
> Lastly, designers breathe life into our work the same way a developer
does.
> Sometimes you just have to let go and wait for round two.
>
> - Jody
>
> Jody Hankinson | Information Architect
> 212.852.5051 | jhankinson at girlscouts.org
> GSUSA | Where Girls Grow Strong | 420 Fifth Avenue, NY, NY 10018
>
> --__--__--
>
> Message: 2
> Reply-To: "Brett-Luxaco" <brett at luxaco.com>
> From: "Brett-Luxaco" <brett at luxaco.com>
> To: "Hankinson, Jody" <JHankinson at girlscouts.org>, <sigia-l at asis.org>
> Subject: Re: [Sigia-l] Visual Balance vs. Left Leaning Layouts
> Date: Tue, 2 Dec 2003 15:13:43 -0600
>
> Hi,
>
> I think you are right about IAs not working with designers or even the
> developers. I have been in a firm where rarely they interacted and it did
> lead to bits of struggle, even though each were really cool people.
Usually
> once the IA is finished their work they leave the project, what happens
when
> things happen and changes have to be made, who is left making them, the
> designer?
>
> Not too sure where this independent attitude is coming from? I work for
> myself so know how one effects the other and all are equally as important
as
> the other.
>
> Brett
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Hankinson, Jody" <JHankinson at girlscouts.org>
> To: <sigia-l at asis.org>
> Sent: Tuesday, December 02, 2003 2:47 PM
> Subject: RE: [Sigia-l] Visual Balance vs. Left Leaning Layouts
>
>
> > I'm a little late to the thread, but I'm surprised by what wasn't
> posted...
> >
> > Have you shared your motivations for wanting the navigation a certain
way?
> I
> > have learned through trial and error that tension arises between the
> > Designers and the IAs, because there isn't enough sharing of the project
> > goals, interface goals and the *usability* goals, i.e. "I'd like the
> > navigation on the left because proximity better illustrates
relationships
> > between the categories, but it also gives us room to grow the navigation
> in
> > the future without subjecting everyone to a new design."
> >
> > If that approach isn't successful, ask for one of the design treatments
to
> > be a reflection of your goals. Three treatments seems to be the norm and
> > I've yet to have anyone balk at trying to prove me wrong by poorly
> designing
> > the approach they don't like. The process can be illuminating for the
> > designer, but it also gives me something I can use for a friends &
family
> > test. Amazing what a quick test around the office can prove even if the
> > color pallet looks like vomit.
> >
> > Lastly, designers breathe life into our work the same way a developer
> does.
> > Sometimes you just have to let go and wait for round two.
> >
> > - Jody
> >
> > Jody Hankinson | Information Architect
> > 212.852.5051 | jhankinson at girlscouts.org
> > GSUSA | Where Girls Grow Strong | 420 Fifth Avenue, NY, NY 10018
> > ------------
> > When replying, please *trim your post* as much as possible.
> > *Plain text, please; NO Attachments
> >
> > Searchable list archive:   http://www.info-arch.org/lists/sigia-l/
> > ________________________________________
> > Sigia-l mailing list -- post to: Sigia-l at asis.org
> > Changes to subscription: http://mail.asis.org/mailman/listinfo/sigia-l
> >
>
>
> --__--__--
>
> Message: 3
> From: Dave Collins <DCollins at phoenix-interactive.com>
> To: sigia-l at asis.org
> Subject: RE: [Sigia-l] Visual Balance vs. Left Leaning Layouts
> Date: Tue, 2 Dec 2003 17:36:34 -0500
>
>
> >I think you are right about IAs not working with designers or even the
> >developers. I have been in a firm where rarely they interacted and it did
> >lead to bits of struggle, even though each were really cool people.
Usually
> >once the IA is finished their work they leave the project, what happens
> when
> >things happen and changes have to be made, who is left making them, the
> designer?
>
> Leave the project??? Not till its rolled out! That's whjat iterative
> development is all about. (At least that's true for usability/UI. Is it
true
> for IA?)
>
> --__--__--
>
> Message: 4
> Date: Wed, 03 Dec 2003 09:40:05 +1100
> To: sigia-l at asis.org
> Subject: Re: [Sigia-l] Visual Balance vs. Left Leaning Layouts
> From: Alexander Johannesen <alex at shelter.nu>
>
> Brett-Luxaco <brett at luxaco.com> wrote:
>
> > I think you are right about IAs not working with designers or even the
> > developers. I have been in a firm where rarely they interacted and it
did
> > lead to bits of struggle, even though each were really cool people.
>
> In my last three years in one of Norways most successful consultancy
> companies, my experiences are the reverse; the IA's were involved in
> every part of the projects, from specification to deployment, so it
> is not a universal constant. This applied to not only IA's working
> in my company, but also external consultants (IA's) working on various
> projects.
>
> ...
>
> > Not too sure where this independent attitude is coming from?
>
>  From your own experiences, I would guess. There is no "such and such
> are what IA's are like." They come in all shapes and sizes, just like
> any other fellow out there.
>
> The conclusion might be that you've had similar experiences, though,
> but that hardly makes it a universal constant.
>
>
> Alexander
> --
> ___________________ ______________________ _____________________________
>                     |                      |
>   http://shelter.nu | http://thinkplot.net | http://shelter.nu/xsiteable
> ___________________|______________________|_____________________________
>
>
> --__--__--
>
> Message: 5
> Date: Wed, 03 Dec 2003 09:36:58 -0500
> From: Michael Rabjohns <michael_rabjohns at hotmail.com>
> To: <sigia-l at asis.org>
> Subject: [Sigia-l] IA, Metrics & org structure
>
> Our firm is considering restructuring its web team, and I'm curious to
know
> which org structures other firms have chosen, and whether or not they're
> working. In particular, we're debating how the IA and Metrics (aka
> Measurement & Analytics) teams should relate - both on same level, one
> reporting to the other, etc.)
>
> Where did IA fit in the organizations you've worked at? Here are a few
> options:
>
> IA, Usability and Metrics report to higher-level manager responsible for
> entire web team
>
> IA reports to Metrics
>
> IA reports to Creative
>
> IA reports to IT
>
> Other
>
>
> Please respond to me offlist at michael_rabjohns at hotmail.com. I'll post
the
> results (without giving company names) by the end of the week.
>
> Thanks!
> Michael
>
>
> --__--__--
>
> Message: 6
> Date: Wed, 3 Dec 2003 08:43:30 -0600
> To: <sigia-l at asis.org>
> From: "Donna M. Fritzsche" <donnamarie at amichi.info>
> Subject: Re: [Sigia-l] IA, Metrics & org structure
>
> What are the responsibilities of your metrics team? I have never
> heard of this as a separate group.
>
> Thanks!
>
> Donna
>
> At 9:36 AM -0500 12/3/03, Michael Rabjohns wrote:
> >Our firm is considering restructuring its web team, and I'm curious to
know
> >which org structures other firms have chosen, and whether or not they're
> >working. In particular, we're debating how the IA and Metrics (aka
> >Measurement & Analytics) teams should relate - both on same level, one
> >reporting to the other, etc.)
> >
> >Where did IA fit in the organizations you've worked at? Here are a few
> >options:
> >
> >IA, Usability and Metrics report to higher-level manager responsible for
> >entire web team
> >
> >IA reports to Metrics
> >
> >IA reports to Creative
> >
> >IA reports to IT
> >
> >Other
> >
> >
> >Please respond to me offlist at michael_rabjohns at hotmail.com. I'll post
the
> >results (without giving company names) by the end of the week.
> >
> >Thanks!
> >Michael
> >
> >------------
> >When replying, please *trim your post* as much as possible.
> >*Plain text, please; NO Attachments
> >
> >Searchable list archive:   http://www.info-arch.org/lists/sigia-l/
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> >Sigia-l mailing list -- post to: Sigia-l at asis.org
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