[Sigia-l] HTML is not a programming language

[T. Karsjens]

I hate to be an ogre, but out of all of the languages you listed Java is the
only programming language.

There is a significant difference between an mark-up language (HTML),
scripting languages (Perl, JavaScript, VBScript) and programming languages
like Java, C++ and Visual Basic.

The capabilities of both mark-up languages and scripting languages are
finite.  You can only do so much with them.  Programming languages are also
finite, but you can create considerably more functionality than with the
other two classifications.

As for DHTML breeching the walls of programming;  I do not see this as
absolute.  There are ways without using DHTML that you can bleed the
presentation layer (the interface-design, html and scripts) into the logic
layer.  .ASP is a prime example of this "violation".  The point that a lot
of people in web application production make is that the layer of complexity
that is introduced by bleeding the layers together adds a lot more risk than
keeping them separate.  Any time you muck with the Input/Output of a system,
complexity arises that is a lot more easily broken.

Bearing this in mind, and trying to keep these layers separate is almost a
futile gesture today, unless you are still building static sites.  Every
application server that powers the applications that we work on has an
interface language.  Microsoft .Net has .asp, J2EE has .jsp, ATG has .jhtml
(moving to JSP), and many more.  These are attempts to add more power to the
interface.

Using application server technology has almost also made static prototyping
obsolete.  Why on earth should I build *anything* in just HTML or DHTML now,
when I can create it in JSP in a third of the time?  Add on top of the time
saved doing a rapid, componentized prototype with the reusability of the
prototype during development greatly reduces the amount of time needed to
develop the interface.  To me, HTML is dead and will always be dead. Except
for the fine point of HTML being what the browser still needs to see, but
even that is changing by tag library support via XML.

I fully realize this may open a can of worms...

Timothy Karsjens
Chief Information Officer
Halley's Fifth
www.halleysfifth.com

-----Original Message-----
From: sigia-l-admin at asis.org [mailto:sigia-l-admin at asis.org]On Behalf Of
robert.dornbush at ps.ge.com
Sent: Thursday, July 18, 2002 8:19 AM
To: sigia-l at asis.org
Subject: [Sigia-l] HTML is not a programming language


proscenium
existence
enamored
tomorrow

well, in all truth, I don't think HTML coding is programming either ,it's
more of an advanced design layout manager.  There are no conditionals,
loops, variables, nothing resembling a programming language.

so if you'll excuse me, I'll get back to managing my thousands of lines of
non-code, do some trial and error debugging on lines 412-688, and then write
a script that makes the transaction wizard more accessible.

of course css is not programming either, but if you add javascript,
vbscript, java, or any other 'programming' language within your html then
you are programming.  so writing pure html is just layout and moreso design
whereas writing dhtml breaches the area of programming. (my opinion)

mystic
crystal
revelation

love,
robert
"I am not a number, I'm a free man"  - The Prisoner
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